Current status?

Chat about Hammerhead's Karoo in general.
JohnJ80
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Re: Current status?

Post by JohnJ80 » Sat Nov 09, 2019 4:00 pm

To the best of my knowledge, neither Garmin or Wahoo publish a roadmap. If they do, I’d like to see it.

Hammerhead used to publish a roadmap and, while nice, I thought it sort of crazy from a product management perspective that they did. It’s common knowledge in tech marketing of the disastrous consequences of the Osborne Effect.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect

Nik
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Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2019 11:07 am

Re: Current status?

Post by Nik » Sat Nov 09, 2019 5:38 pm

Dobbel wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:25 pm
Thats´s fine. No worries about your tone. Only that some words may be misinterpreted by other people reading it.
Words written can be interpreted differently than spoken words. And with mimics included it would be even better, but hey.... this is a forum, so we have to live with reading.
Considering how people are raving on the HH forum, FB group and comment section of every review on the net you can find, I would be surprised if my opinion could cause much damage here
:roll:

Nik
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Re: Current status?

Post by Nik » Sat Nov 09, 2019 5:41 pm

JohnJ80 wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 4:00 pm
To the best of my knowledge, neither Garmin or Wahoo publish a roadmap. If they do, I’d like to see it.

Hammerhead used to publish a roadmap and, while nice, I thought it sort of crazy from a product management perspective that they did. It’s common knowledge in tech marketing of the disastrous consequences of the Osborne Effect.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect
It is difficult to raise interest in an upcoming product while still doing expectation management. I am sure they would have released a finished product if they could have fixed the funding up front

JohnJ80
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Re: Current status?

Post by JohnJ80 » Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:11 pm

Getting people to buy into the first version is a very different problem than getting people to buy into the subsequent versions. In point of fact, that is exactly the problem Osborne Computer got into that led to their demise. It was the second version with the published roadmap and specs that stopped sales in expectation of buying v2.0. You almost *have* to publish futures to get people to buy into the first version but after that, you need to stop with advance publication of specs unless you have tons of money and you can take the hit financially and to your reputation if your product is late. Bear in mind the financial hit is huge if you’re a one product line company (like Hammerhead).

I’m sure their newest board members and investors/money guys stopped the publishing of the roadmaps. It’s the kind of argument that sort of ends with “what part of ‘No’ did you not understand?”

The way you introduce the next product is you build up substantial cash reserves to bridge the period when sales crash looking for v2.0 (look at Apple’s sales numbers in the qtr prior to their new iPhone launch, for example). Then, when you introduce it to full production you can start pushing the information out to the market in a veiled way getting ever more specific just prior to launch. But if you do it while engineering is ongoing, you are putting your entire company at risk if something goes wrong and it’s delayed beyond what your saved cash can support.

The tech world has been managing this since the 1980’s. It’s not new and there are people with a lot of product marketing experience that know how this works (and what can be fatal).

Just look at how the CEO of Wahoo talked about the possibility of a Speedplay based power meter. He acknowledged that it’s a hole in the market but he absolutely would not say they were going to embark on it even if it would be almost stupid to not do so. And I doubt you’ll hear anything from the company about it until they have their preproduction units in hand, have thoroughly tested them and are moving into the first full production run. That’s how you keep the sex and sizzle to create excitement when you need it - right at the time people can commit and put down money to get them.

Nik
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Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2019 11:07 am

Re: Current status?

Post by Nik » Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:45 am

Of course with software features there is lesser risk because you know you will also get them later for free when they are released

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Steve
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Re: Current status?

Post by Steve » Sun Nov 10, 2019 4:45 pm

JohnJ80 wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 4:00 pm
To the best of my knowledge, neither Garmin or Wahoo publish a roadmap. If they do, I’d like to see it.

Hammerhead used to publish a roadmap and, while nice, I thought it sort of crazy from a product management perspective that they did. It’s common knowledge in tech marketing of the disastrous consequences of the Osborne Effect.
No. The main reason that Hammerhead published a roadmap originally was because there were so many lacking features in the product from day one. It was important from the start to show when features might appear, but buyers were let down very badly because much was promised and very little delivered. Even now there are huge numbers of features missing that Wahoo and Garmin have had for a very long time. So that's why they should have a roadmap.

It's nothing to do with the Osborne effect. Sure, Hammerhead probably shouldn't publish any roadmap for Karoo v2 (which they are undoubtedly working on), because of the danger of killing sales. But they should have a roadmap for all those missing features that their competitors currently have.

Nik
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Re: Current status?

Post by Nik » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:23 pm

I see no problems in publishing a roadmap with software features that have been approved by the developers as being technically feasible (been prototyped) with little architectural significance and no external dependencies (e.g. licenses). Hardware changes is another thing

JohnJ80
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Re: Current status?

Post by JohnJ80 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:38 pm

Well, they are not going to do it. Pretty sure I know why but it’s a moot point anyhow.

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