Mount attachment karoo broken

Chat about Hammerhead's Karoo in general.
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drisotope
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Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:12 pm
Location: SoCal, USA!

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by drisotope »

Orrocle wrote:
Fri May 04, 2018 10:08 am
Hi drisotope
Am I right in thinking the dogears mount attaches to the karoo mount. So if the karoo mount screw failed they would both fall off?
The Karoo mount is abandoned completely in my pic-- I made what is essentially a stepped aluminum ring to adapt the DogEarsGPS part to the Karoo. So it's all aluminum. The only way for it to fall off would be for the threaded insert inside the Karoo to tear out completely.

I really like what @Barisky is doing-- but don't forget to add the little tab that the lanyard catches on.

Barisky
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2018 12:03 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by Barisky »

Hi,

Thanks for the feedback :P .

For now I just wanted to have the rough model and as strong as possible. Later I'll add some recession to accommodate the lanyard.

Thanks.

rb010013
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri May 04, 2018 3:27 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by rb010013 »

My mount has broken as well and the lack of response from Hammerhead support is really, really p*ssing me off. This is my second mount. The first one they sent was loose in the barfly rather than clicking in securely like my old Garmin. The second was better, but not perfect. I asked for another and essentially they said "it'll be ok, put up with it".
Well I did and it broke within a 1,000 miles of riding. In the lead up to it breaking you could see the Karoo rock back and forth, so instead of the load being reacted thru' the footing lugs it was being reacted at the locating screw; this led to a shear failure around the screw. Fortunately the lanyard restrained the Karoo.
Having previously had prompt response from Hammerhead support via email I have heard nothing from them since I informed them 3 days ago, other than an automated acknowledgment. I am to say the least very disappointed. I now have a device that I cannot use.
My view as a Chartered mechanical engineer is that the footing design is not fit for purpose. Comparison with any Garmin shows that the lugs are too thin, hence the lack of a secure fit, they appear to be made of a brittle material and the footing on the Garmin is integral with the casing rather than being screwed on, which creates an inherent weak point in the Karoo.
The provision of a lanyard in the first place tells me that Hammerhead were aware that there was an issue with their footing. It really is disappointing that a low tech component is really letting the Karoo down.
I do hope Hammerhead sort this out. The offline mapping in particular seems to be an excellent feature but the bugs, failures and lack of support are unacceptable
Attachments
Karoo footing fail.JPG
Karoo footing fail.JPG (1.64 MiB) Viewed 4790 times

JohnJ80
Posts: 272
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by JohnJ80 »

drisotope wrote:
Fri May 04, 2018 1:38 pm
Orrocle wrote:
Fri May 04, 2018 10:08 am
Hi drisotope
Am I right in thinking the dogears mount attaches to the karoo mount. So if the karoo mount screw failed they would both fall off?
The Karoo mount is abandoned completely in my pic-- I made what is essentially a stepped aluminum ring to adapt the DogEarsGPS part to the Karoo. So it's all aluminum. The only way for it to fall off would be for the threaded insert inside the Karoo to tear out completely.

I really like what @Barisky is doing-- but don't forget to add the little tab that the lanyard catches on.
Agree! And I like what you've done to this with your all Aluminum prototype.

I bought the lanyards that you suggested and like those a lot. This will be the first time I've even used a lanyard on any bike computer. Says a lot about how much I trust their mount.

Other than worried about breaking, mine doesn't wiggle in the K-edge mounts I have. But it does want to rotate anytime I try and push one of the side buttons. I have to grab the whole thing with a hand and one one of the fingers to push the button or I risk it coming out of the mount by rotating to the open position. I'm an electrical not a mechanical engineer, but it seems to me that the tabs need to have more interference in the mount so there is more friction and it's harder to rotate the device.

If someone is going to make a better mount and sell them, count me in.

J.

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drisotope
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Location: SoCal, USA!

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by drisotope »

The image in @rb010013's pic is my idea of a worst-case scenario. It has nothing to do with the interface between the quarter-turn and the mount itself-- the plastic mount on the Karoo itself failed mechanically. That's... bad. I made my aluminum prototype out of scrap I had on-hand, and don't have enough of that size rod lying around to make another. But 1.5" 6061 rod is not especially expensive, so next time I'm down near my metals supplier, I'll pick up another rod and see if I can't knock out a few more. Because I get the feeling that as more Karoos get into people's hands, the more mount failures we're going to see.

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Steve
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Location: Surrey, UK

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by Steve »

jhnbssll wrote:
Sun Apr 29, 2018 6:18 pm
I did tag Caffery Garff in my initial facebook post but perhaps it would be a good idea for someone with a failed base plate who is already in contact with <HH> to forward them my suggestions? I'm not interested in taking credit, moreso in getting Karoo users (myself included) a reliable mounting system.
Well it seems that HH certainly did notice jhnbssll's suggestions. He's been specifically thanked by HH's head of hardware in the latest blog post from HH (which I only just looked at, since I didn't realise before that it had more than just the latest software changelog in it):
A statement from Robert, our Head of Hardware:

I’m Robert Martinez and I run the hardware team here [at Hammerhead]. I’ve been keeping a close eye on these bracket foot fractures and would like to update the community…

We’re currently working with our vendors on the next version of the bracket foot, which will incorporate a combination of geometry and material optimizations. We completed a tooling revision last week and are validating the changes now on improved test jigs. [We] will update everyone once we’ve signed off on the revision and have the production run scheduled.

I want to note here that the feedback from our customers has been as understanding as it has been actionable. In particular, I would like to highlight John Bissell’s excellent analysis regarding stress concentrations and material considerations. It’s feedback like this that makes developing hardware for this community extremely rewarding. I aim to exceed expectations with these changes and look forward to continually improving the Karoo experience.


The cause of the known failures is still undetermined, but affected users will be offered a replacement bracket foot at no charge as soon as they are available. Karoo’s bracket foot is designed to be easily interchangeable, with different brackets or other accessories, for this reason.
Great work from jhnbssll!

JohnJ80
Posts: 272
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by JohnJ80 »

Steve wrote:
Sun May 06, 2018 7:03 pm

Great work from jhnbssll!
No kidding. Great work indeed.

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drisotope
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Location: SoCal, USA!

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by drisotope »

Thought I would mention it here, as I'm a one-at-a-time small shop guy, but if anyone fears for their Karoo or already has a broken mount foot and would like to go the DogEarsGPS route, I can produce the adapter ring, I've already made a few:

Image

I've not real idea how to price it, as there's not much to it in the way of materials, but they're ridiculously labor intensive, taking over an hour to make each one. But every time I check in on the FB Karoo group and see another broken mount, I think, I should probably make a couple more of these.

nordog
Posts: 183
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:32 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by nordog »

Looks pretty good to me but just the one small center screw takes a fair load I would think drisotope. Mine get a lot of punishment as I ride over the roots and road potholes so how come mind is still OK and other are not, they must be busting wheels and bike front forks as the charge into the road kerbing.

User avatar
drisotope
Posts: 137
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:12 pm
Location: SoCal, USA!

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by drisotope »

The only way my adapter is coming off is if the threaded insert inside the Karoo itself is physically ripped out-- and we have yet to see an instance of that. Either the tabs break, or the whole thing breaks off around the center screw.

The OEM rings are breaking because they didn't get the fiber mix right in the plastic. Too rigid, too brittle. I haven't had any issues with my factory piece either, but I'm not taking any chances. It's sitting in a drawer.

jhnbssll
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:50 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by jhnbssll »

Only just seen this... Awesome :mrgreen:

I hope the fixes work... :lol:

Drizt
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:18 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by Drizt »

drisotope wrote:
Wed May 09, 2018 8:02 pm
Thought I would mention it here, as I'm a one-at-a-time small shop guy, but if anyone fears for their Karoo or already has a broken mount foot and would like to go the DogEarsGPS route, I can produce the adapter ring, I've already made a few:

Image

I've not real idea how to price it, as there's not much to it in the way of materials, but they're ridiculously labor intensive, taking over an hour to make each one. But every time I check in on the FB Karoo group and see another broken mount, I think, I should probably make a couple more of these.
Any long term review you can share?

Wondering if the hammerhead feet are still breaking on new units?

Are people able to buy this alloy adapter and dogears option?

bikebikebike
Posts: 21
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:11 pm

Just flat a##ed dropped mine

Post by bikebikebike »

Lost grip with dry slippery hands
outer case flew off and chipped in a minor way, o/w intact
Whew
any tips or warnings on gluing/sticking a lanyard mount other than on the Garmin Mount ?

ZenTurtle
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Feb 10, 2020 8:00 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by ZenTurtle »

Is there a new link for the 3D print file?
What type of plastic do you recommend?

Do you know if anyone made a version compatible with Wahoo mounts instead?
Barisky wrote:
Fri May 04, 2018 9:29 am
Hi all,

Found a 3D model in the web and started to tweak it to fit Karoo which is a "little" different because it's angled. Here's my first model attempt.

I'll try to 3D print it in ABS during the weekend to see if it fits correctly and make some adjustments since the final idea would be to print it in a 3D metal printer.

I'll make the 3D file (STEP or IGES format) available here later so you guys can also use it.

mount_foot_1.jpgmount_foot.jpg


Link for the 3D model: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1DBML2H ... sp=sharing

Manwell MTB
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jul 28, 2020 3:00 pm

Re: Mount attachment karoo broken

Post by Manwell MTB »

Hi drisotope !!! I have exactly the same problem as you guys . So I would like to know if you sort this issue by your self's or hammerhead.io are sorting this issue . I also read that you could make your own foot bracket . Can you make one if you have the materials please ? I'll donate some money through PayPal. Thanks in advanced.

Regards , Manwell

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